Arcade ROM BOP Values

[ultimate7]

SF:

Bonds, Mays, Ott   What can you say Say Hey, plus Bonds, gotta be a strong OF no matter how bad Ott was.

Brown, Dark, Fuentes, McCovey.. Really no clue

Rader also no clue

Mays carries them to a 6 unless someone has more info

[JoeDirt]

These are great...thanks ult.  Keep 'em comin'!

[ultimate7]

Cinci:

Foster, Griffey, Pinson:  Griffey is strong in Center, I'm guessing Foster is probably the one real weakness of this defense

Rose, Concepcion, Morgan, Perez:  Very strong up the middle, Perez and Rose are probably above average.

Bench:  All time great

Rating: 4

[ultimate7]

These last 2 teams are probably the toughest because so many old timers:

Boston:

Yaz, Lynn, Williams (any real CF?)  I really don't know, Yaz and Williams could hit, and I doubt either were Manny level defense, but were they strong?

Boggs, Burly, Doerr, Fox   ( Boggs was decent, Burly too, no clue on the right side, I'd guess Doerr was good but I don't know)

Fisk: strong

Rating: 7

NYY

Dimmagio, Mantle, Ruth:  Gotta be strong I guess, was Mantle Sober?  Was it before he tore up his knee, obvioubly Mantle and JoeD are strong

Nettles, Lazzeri, Rizzuto, Gehrig  (Nettles was great I guess the middle was strong too, but really not certain) Gehrig?  Probably solid

Berra:  Strong

Rating: 6

[ultimate7]

I'd love for Dryden to do a quick review of all these values.

[Gantry]

Nice work Ultimate!  I emailed Dryden to see if he can give them a view.  Hopefully he'll have some time in the next day or so...

[Dryden]

The easiest quick way to do this, I'd say, would be to pick up a copy (or just swing by a bookstore) of Bill James' Win Shares and take a look at the fielding ratings for each of the players in the rom, then either assign a value by position or just average across all of them.

I'd probably do the following:

SS: 10
C: 9
2B: 8
CF: 7
3B: 5
RF: 3
LF: 2
1B:1

Multiply these by the player ratings (a 10 for A+, 9 for A, etc.) to get a composite score, pick a range of values you want the ratings to run from/to, and see how they distribute.

I'll throw up another post to try to summarize what I know of specific player D in a sec...

[BeeJay]

I'm pretty sure that Joe wants to get this thing ordered today, so that's probably out of the question.  Ultimate's guess work is probably more than sufficient for such a small detail.  I know most of you pay much closer attention to the game than I do, but I've never really noticed a difference in bops between the different teams.

[fknmclane]

I know most of you pay much closer attention to the game than I do, but I've never really noticed a difference in bops between the different teams.

You should have watched me and usc's first game at the tourney.  6 fucking BOPS for the Tigers.  Needless to say, a winner was not me.

[Dryden]

From what I know (or at least think I know...)

Dodgers: Robinson ++, Campanella ++, Reese ++, Snider ++, Garvey +, Guerrero --, Davis +, Cey 0
Cards: Smith ++, Flood ++, Boyer ++. Musial +, Brock 0, Hornsby --, Simmons --, Clark --
Oakland: Canseco --, McGwire --, Jackson -, Henderson 0, Campaneris ++, others?
Houston: Cruz ++, Cedeno ++, Doran 0, Thon +, Ashby +
Atlanta: Murphy ++, Aaron 0, Horner --, Torre -, Ramirez +, Mathews 0
Chicago: Dawson ++, Wilson 0, Williams 0, Santo ++, Banks -, Sandberg +, Cavaretta +, Davis +
San Fran: Mays ++, Bonds ++, Ott ++, McCovey +
Reds: Rose -, Concepcion +, Morgan ++, Bench ++, Perez 0, Griffey 0, Foster -
Boston: Williams --, Lynn +, Yaz +, Doerr +, Boggs +, Fisk ++, Foxx +
New York: Mantle ++, DiMaggio ++, Ruth -, Gehrig 0, Nettles +, Berra +, Rizzuto ++, Lazzeri 0


(on a ++, +, 0, -, --) rating scale.

[Dryden]

I'd rate them, as teams:

Dodgers
Yankees
Astros
Reds
Red Sox
Giants
Cubs
Cardinals
Braves
Athletics

[Gantry]

Nice work Dryden!  I'll mail you a coupon for a free Old Style on your next trip to Chicago...

[JoeDirt]

obvioubly Mantle and JoeD are strong

Thanks Ult.  That's really sweet of you to say about me

[JoeDirt]

wasnt mcg a gold glove winner?  too lazy to look up, but i think i recall being pissed that mattingly didnt win it that yr...

[Dryden]

Guys win gold gloves with their bats all the time.  If Derek Jeter deserves a gold glove, then no one does.

[JoeDirt]

so, what--i suppose next you're gonna say palmeiro didn't deserve his gold glove for playing a stellar 1b for 17 games out of a 162 game season?  Some people...

[Attezzobal]

I just PMed this to Ult7, but I thought I'd post it and see what you guys think regarding bops and defensive rating accuracy.

Take this for what it's worth, and to check it out yourself, go to www.smallworld.com, my login info is (PM if you want) and password is (PM if you want it) click on one of my "all time great teams" either the Fighting Sioux, Toledo Maumees, or NDSU Bison, you can go through and check out defensive ratings and compare them to a bunch of teams from the original RBI.

For instance, take the 1987 Cards according to sporting news strat-o-matic.

Coleman  3e10
Ozzie         1e10
Herr           2e8
Clark          4e19
McGee          1e8
Pendleton      1e28
Ford             2e9
Pena         2e8

The first number represents the range, 1 being the best, 5 being the worst, the number following the "e" represents how many errors could be expected (this is based on a single season, but of the RBI Teams are Houston, NYM, Stl and I believe Detroit)

I'd say about 75% of Arcade players are in this version of strat, you don't have to do it this way, but I may go down and make some comparisons with the original RBI teams and their ratings based on this once I get the time.

Anyway, check it out if you want, it's the best I've seen as far as accurate defensive ratings and what-not.

[Dryden]

I'd take strat's ratings as being meaningfully credible.

[ultimate7]

I'd rate them, as teams:

Dodgers    4
Yankees    5
Astros    5
Reds    5
Red Sox    6
Giants    6
Cubs    7
Cardinals    7
Braves    9
Athletics    10

We could go with these, but I don't really have any more time to spend on this.  Thanks for the link Azz, I was about to go there, but then realized it would entail me spending more time then this is worth at this point.

[Gantry]

Those values work for me...